Pt. 1: 29 Palms Military Base MASS UFO. "A Debate" feat. Ret. Veteran Grider & Arthur Preston

0:06 Speaker 1: All right, guys, welcome back to Total Disclosure. We have a special presentation for you tonight. Tonight. I've been seeing that has been in the works for some time and I just got involved very recently. It has to do with the twenty nine Palms mass sighting case where over fifty Marines allegedly saw lights in the sky unprompted, unknowingly and reported as a UFO corbel George Knapp and the platform weaponized where the first ones to break said story, and since then a lot of back and forth has been going down throughout not just a community, but we're talking Department of Defense spokes spokesperson Susan Go getting an answer within twenty four hours from the base saying that it was that simply an exercise and that there was no UAP in the vicinity.

1:18 Speaker 1: So much more, We're gonna break it all down. I don't want to waste too much time. We're gonna do this in a structure debate style, very very gentleman esque. Yeah, there'll be a little drama, tensions will flare, but we'll keep it to a minimum. With that being said, like share, subscribe, and if you want to help support the show, become a member. This is not the time for that. I'm gonna bring these guys in so arguing and on the side of anomaly and a UFO is Arthur President, who is just on our live show revamped Arthur.

1:58 Speaker 1: You are continuing the research into this case, bringing it up to speed, up to date, while you know it's kind of been in the lull. Jeremy really hasn't come out and given any more evidence, but you've been continuing to work on the case.

2:19 Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, Ty, and thanks for having me on. I definitely think it's UFOs. I think the community is mostly wrong. I think they got it wrong on this one. So I want to thank you Ty for shining some light on this case again and getting the dialogue going and some more debate going, because I think it's really an important case.

2:39 Speaker 1: Yeah. I'm not really sure what just happened. It's said go live, it said that we weren't live. Are we live right now?

2:51 Speaker 3: Yeah?

2:52 Speaker 2: I saw we're live.

2:54 Speaker 1: If anyone's listening around right now, I just want to before I bring Grider, Okay, we are, because there was there was like a disconnect between my computer and what was actually happening. Sorry about that, guys, grider. You you'll have military experience with flares. You are opposing the view that this was some sort of anomaly, that this was just another routine training exercise held at a base in California that is known for doing training and exercises.

3:36 Speaker 4: Yeah, guys, hey, thank you so much for having me. Ty Arthur, it's good to see you again. I'm here to, you know, rebunk the debunk on the original. I mean, you're a reality debunker, Arthur. You're just you're trying to make up, you know, something that's not there.

3:51 Speaker 3: I'm here to set the I mean, I'm here to set the record straight and put this case in straight into bed all right forever, because we're sick of this. I mean, we're tired of all this nonsense. Right, it was Flairs. I've got the documents, all right, I've got the proof, the facts. You're done. All right, You're done tonight. It ends tonight.

4:12 Speaker 1: Already. I like I said, I love it. I love it so again. We are going to allow for everyone to get their moment in the sun. Their their their main caveat, they're getting their best foot forward. Now, I do want to go over a couple things. Now, I think what would be best is an introduction of each person from each person, lasting five anywhere five seven minutes, to briefly introduce your reference frame and your opposing viewpoints, the flares versusu AP anomaly, and we'll kind of go from go from there, introducing evidence, calling it out by number, and half are back and forth.

5:10 Speaker 3: So can I go on in a start?

5:12 Speaker 1: I guess yes, you may.

5:14 Speaker 3: All right.

5:15 Speaker 4: So, basically my experience that lends me some credibility in this is that I was a former foot artilleryman in the United States Army. I was a thirteen Bravo, which is a canning crew member basically, which went and I fired artillery. That was what I did all deployment. And I probably fired over ten thousand rounds in my life, with probably twenty five hundred being illumination rounds, which are basically parachute flares, not the same as aircraft parachute flaares, you know, which is what we see in.

5:49 Speaker 3: This video, but same type of you know, same type of device. And so basically excuse me. It's basically what.

6:01 Speaker 4: Arthur's going to do is he's gonna come out and he's going to talk about the credibility of the witnesses and the you know, he's gonna say that, uh, you know that there were fifty marines that saw it and that they said that it wasn't Flair's and that they know because of their experience and YadA, YadA, YadA. And then he's going to, uh talk about how Susan go you know, quickly dismissed the case, you know, with then you know she was able to come out with when a couple.

6:25 Speaker 3: Of hours I think, you know, I think by lunch, Yeah, like by lunch that day, so like it was submitted in like one am, and then by noon, you know, she had she had a statement out.

6:38 Speaker 4: Well, I mean that okay, you know I can kind of give Arthur that. And then he's going to talk about, you know, maybe the comparison to like the Phoenix Light incidents, you know, talk about how it's it's comparable though there's something to be drawn there, you know, and he's going to, uh, you know, he's going to say a lot of things that are not true, and I'm going to tack all that because I've got the evidence. I've got the exact evidence showing that there were a lumination rounds. I are illumination rounds being used in the massive air exercise that was taking place at that exact time that they had the sighting.

7:10 Speaker 4: I have the documents thanks to John Greenwald. Thank you, sir. If you're out there listening, you're probably not.

7:16 Speaker 1: But he's a friend of the show.

7:18 Speaker 4: Oh he is out there listening. Thank you, Thank you John. You yeah, man, you really helped. You know, you're great with Foya Black Vault, best side ever.

7:27 Speaker 3: But yeah, I have the exact the exact type of aircraft that fired those rounds, the exact planned FTX schedule, which is a field training exercise. I know the exact you know pathway that it took across the twenty nine Palms range. I can prove with maps, you know that the exact location that the flares were dropped over is the only place within twenty nine Palms that is cleared for that type of ordinance to be used. We're gonna look at pictures where I'm gonna, you know, show you which I think is the Mick West debunk that has already been kind kind of you know, beating like a dead horse, but uh, you know it's He's also.

8:06 Speaker 1: He's also a friend of the show. And and and unlike others in the community, I don't think. I don't dismiss him. I think he keeps us grounded in a way that you know, there are some cases that are pretty cut and dry mis identifications.

8:25 Speaker 3: Absolutely.

8:26 Speaker 4: I mean, I'm a fan of Micwest personally, but yeah, he does great work. But I haven't even looked at any of his work, I promise Scouts honor. Like all the research that I've done is from my own brain, so it may not be up to the level of Mick West.

8:40 Speaker 3: But.

8:42 Speaker 4: I think I'm pretty confident, you know, and being able to make this case, and I just want to, you know, kind of make it a point, you know, that people need to that people could look at this case. There's something to be learned from as far as paxes and the way that hoaxes develop and they perpetuate across like, you know, years, decades, even about how group think and about how I mean, I have a well, there's an entire segment that I have where I've got bullet points listening how a hoax develops and going back to like the Philadelphia experiment and Bob Blazar and talking about how those perpetuated and comparing those to this case.

9:19 Speaker 4: And yeah, so I mean we'll get into that later, but that's my introduction.

9:23 Speaker 3: And thanks.

9:24 Speaker 1: Okay, So just to be clear about your experience, you don't have experience with the the flair and I'm and I'm just I'm not I'm not belittling you. I'm not. I'm not discrediting your experience with flaares overall. I'm just simply trying to clarify the illumin arounds that you say are in the air you didn't ever actually deploy.

9:54 Speaker 4: No, I was never in the Air Force. Yeah, are in the Marines. I was never a crew member on an aircraft. But it's the exact same thing. It's the exact same type of chemicals, the exact same like, the exact same mechanism of deployment.

10:07 Speaker 3: Uh, It's it's identical almost.

10:11 Speaker 1: Okay, okay, all right, So thank you, Griider. I'm gonna pull it over to Arthur, let him get his moment to kind of like let us know where he's coming from, where he's gonna start his you know where he's going to start his evidence trail. Uh, and uh, you know, give us his brief five minutes.

10:37 Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, I thank you Grid and Ty. Yeah. So my my position is that this was a genuine UAP event. It wasn't misidentified flares. There's quite a few points I want to make, but I think writer is gonna undermine the credibility of the witnesses. I think he might start throwing out, you know, fantasies or you know ideas that these guys are throwing a practical joke and making this up. And I just want to make it very clear. I think all the witnesses are telling the truth. I think they're very sincere.

11:12 Speaker 2: I don't think they're misremembering. And that's probably some of our strongest evidence is the witnesses, and most all of the skeptics want to ignore all of the witnesses and their testimony. And these are military witnesses, and we have five of them that actually adds a lot of credibility in this case, has a lot of information associated with it. We have like seven videos, we have like five low light photos of the event, and we have metadata associated with a lot of this. And then we have a whole tranch of Foya documents and Foya photos and Foya videos also with metadata.

11:50 Speaker 2: And that's where I've done most of My analysis is comparing the FOYA documents to the original documents, and in that analysis, I think I found very strong evidence of fraud, meaning that this was some sort of pre bunking operation by arrow Susan Go the Department of Defense, and that this was a major event, a mass sighting witness not by only fifty that was the bare minimum of fifty. According to witnesses, Probably in the hundreds, if not up to one thousand people witnessed this. In one photo alone, we see like six people with their phone their smartphones out recording it.

12:29 Speaker 2: So there's probably a bunch more video out there. And I want to bring some more light to this case and maybe we can get some more evidence, some more witnesses, some more video or photos of the event, and this could become the next Phoenix Lights. This could be as big as the Phoenix Lights because this is a mass sighting at a military base. We have on duty witnesses, military witnesses and video so this and I think it was a big mistake that the community glanced over this having some technical issues.

13:02 Speaker 1: No no, no, you're goals.

13:05 Speaker 2: I think it was a major mistake that the community moved on from this case. So quickly. I think a lot of the community is operating on kind of a low information basis on this case. They they got the debunk from Mick West and John Greenwald, you know, within twenty four hours. It was very compelling at first glance. So at first glance their debunks seemed like conclusive, and most people just kind of accepted it and moved on, never really dug into this case ever.

13:32 Speaker 1: And I will say that I am one of those people who did really see this case and just kind of let it go in it and want to hear out the other So I want to hold it on something. What you have no military experience.

13:54 Speaker 2: Right, correct?

13:56 Speaker 1: Do you have any background in flair and illumination?

14:02 Speaker 2: No, no firsthand experience with Flair's I guess the only thing that might add its first credentials wise is I do have a degree in biology which had physics training, so I have taken you know, the basic physics courses, and then I also have a master's screen public alpaation isn't really applicable at all to this, but I have scientific training, so I'm applying my research skills to this case.

14:26 Speaker 1: So and that's where I was trying to get to so I think what we should do is we should start with very simple, very very very simple. There's an argument that you both make, and it has to do with the witnesses and the credibility of the witnesses. So I kind of want to start there, maybe with some of the videos and kind of watching them, going through them together, uh and then having you each uh point out your side. If that makes sense, let me a mute grinder.

15:10 Speaker 2: That sounds good. I think we should. You should go over the videos, the evidence, kind of educate the audience, the the you know, the the core of this case.

15:23 Speaker 1: Yes, so good.

15:27 Speaker 4: So what I'm asserting is that there is no way that the Marines did not know what was going on. I'm not calling them liars. I'm calling them perceptive. And that's a really, that's a really. I mean like that's like, I'm the type of person where as a veteran like I would give anything if I came across a veteran on the street that needed help or whatever. It's like, those are my brothers. But they're pulling everybody's chain and they know it, and they they absolutely know it. And I'm going to prove by the end of this that it's undeniable that they know it.

16:00 Speaker 1: See I was going to mention that earlier that did bring It sparked something in me that you are essentially

16:12 Speaker 1: not not like you said, you're not dishonoring the military, but you're saying that these group of individuals are perpetuating some sort of hoax and with knowledge of it being some sort of test and something that they could have timed and shown to the world as a UFO.

16:44 Speaker 4: That's not what I'm no, like, I want to go that far. What I am saying is that there's no way that they did not know that those are flares. There's no way. And by by the end of this, it'll be really really clear why I say that. Am I calling the liars?

17:01 Speaker 3: No?

17:02 Speaker 1: But well I have to. I think we have to make a distinction. I well, one second, I think we need to make a distinction before we hear them, because they either they are there a are liars and they're lying. Now after the event happened, and maybe I wasn't right, maybe I didn't phrase that correctly, but a time, place, and situation arose. They got video of it and reported it to Jerry meet Carbell. So somewhere along the lines, you would have to be saying that they are lying.

17:44 Speaker 4: All right there, my brothers, but and I respect them, and but somebody's lying about this. I don't know somebody absolutely is lying, like yeah.

17:57 Speaker 1: And I can agree with you there, I absolutely kind of think Arthur could even.

18:02 Speaker 2: I just want a little clarity on that where they because we have the witnesses reacting in live time on the video, and we also have interviews with the witnesses at a later point of time. Are you suggesting that they were lying in both of those k both in live time and then later down as they are interviewed at a later point in time.

18:23 Speaker 3: Definitely not.

18:24 Speaker 4: I'm not saying anybody is specifically lying because I do not know for a fact what that person is actually was actually thinking and is actually thinking even nowadays, Like I have no idea what they're thinking inside their head. If they really believe that there's some the thing is like seeing IR flares, that's a rarity.

18:41 Speaker 3: So most of those soldiers, you know, you think, oh, yeah, well they were Marines, but I guarantee that most of them were fresh out of you know, basic they were probably.

18:51 Speaker 2: You actually don't know that writer, You don't know what any of their ranks were.

18:57 Speaker 3: They were definitely like lower enlisted apps. You can just tell the by the way that they talk.

19:02 Speaker 2: You're guessing that. I tend to agree that they sound young, but that is just a guess on our behalf.

19:08 Speaker 3: At the end of the day, most of the people that are in the military are young. You know that, right.

19:13 Speaker 2: They're trained Marines.

19:16 Speaker 3: They were in training, you know at that time.

19:18 Speaker 2: And it's not boot camp. They're out of boot I mean.

19:22 Speaker 1: Yeah, but Camp Wilson, if if I'm not mistaken, Camp Wilson is a staging area for the most part. It's not just a staging area, but it it's you are sent there right before you head out to the range. If I'm not mistaken, that's the intel I've gathered. So it seems like they would be on the younger side if I had to say, But I don't think that necessarily discounts anything.

20:03 Speaker 2: Well, these guys are making life decisions. I mean, they're trusting. You know, these guys are firing heavy weapons, and they're not children. They're not idiots, even though they might be new.

20:18 Speaker 1: Yeah, you're right, you didn't. You did not say that.

20:20 Speaker 2: I'm just saying that to the audience.

20:21 Speaker 3: So I guess, like, okay, so there's a point where I don't know if it's in the interview.

20:28 Speaker 4: I think it is. Actually no, I think it's in when they're actually having the sighting and one of them says, oh, well, you don't fire flares in a in a five gun you know, battery. Yeah, yeah, no, five guns in a battery. But you know, if you've been down range, then you know that are then you do know the aircraft, you know, drop in fives, They drop in sets of five.

20:50 Speaker 3: That's very, very common.

20:51 Speaker 4: So the fact that he said that and like he couldn't identify the difference between an indirect fired you know round that is a parachute flair like that would be in that's probably I don't know, that could be either or really but yeah, I mean that's uh.

21:07 Speaker 1: I'm just showing some examples of what flairs that's.

21:11 Speaker 4: That's yeah, see, that's probably artillery. And then this yeah five see, and I mean just look how this okay, well, I mean, you know, we'll get into it, but yeah, I mean, just the fact that and there's a couple of other points, you know, the where like the Marines kind of contradict themselves, and they kind of show that they don't really have a lot of experience. I mean, I'm not discounting, you know, these people as soldiers as individuals, like they're better than ninety percent of the people that are out there, the ninety percent of civilians.

21:39 Speaker 4: Like they've already made the sacrifice, they've already shown that they have character, that they have integrity, that they are, that they're men. That's not what I'm saying. I'm just saying that somebody is lying, and that's that's just how it is.

21:52 Speaker 1: Fair enough, fair enough, let's leave it there. Fly a little bit high on that one, all right. So I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna give it Arthur first. Arthur, what do you want me to pull out?

22:07 Speaker 2: Why don't we go through the Why don't you go through the videos? So why don't you bring up video one and we'll just go through the videos of the event, all right?

22:19 Speaker 1: Right, So what I want, yes, what I was gonna say is what I want to do, if we're gonna do the videos, is we're gonna give you both a chance to respond to the videos. Okay, okay, all right. I just want to make sure that in the media thread,

22:41 Speaker 1: it doesn't look like it.

22:43 Speaker 2: Should say event event video one.

22:47 Speaker 1: Oh I got it.

22:49 Speaker 3: Yeah. Hey, so all the videos, like all the official videos, you're gonna be.

22:55 Speaker 1: Yep, I got it here. I'm sorry, guys, this is gonna be This is gonna be a learning curve. Someone's got some.

23:17 Speaker 2: And just to put some context into this video that he's about to play, h he's using a cell phone to video the night sky. So they're actually seeing a lot more than what's going to be showing up in these videos. So you're gonna see some some lights in the sky, but just recognize that what we see on this video is probably less than what the people on the ground are actually seeing.

23:40 Speaker 1: All right, So we are going to go into full mode, so basically like a full full screen mode. Can you gotta see it?

23:53 Speaker 2: Yeah? What is Okay?

24:07 Speaker 5: That's it.

24:08 Speaker 2: So that's pretty short. A seventeen seconds is the first video. I guess what I would comment on this is that it's very symmetrical looking like in this first video, it's very symmetrical and like a B formation, So that's that's noteworthy. And then the other thing that's noteworthy is the witness is recording it. It says, what is that? So they at least he can't isn't able to identify it at that time.

24:36 Speaker 3: Okay, grader, I mean it's yeah, man, it's symmetrical right there.

24:42 Speaker 4: But why does it change shape? Like why does it become less of a like? Why does it lose its symmetricality? I don't know, Like, what's the word it's.

24:51 Speaker 2: It doesn't stay symmetry, It doesn't stay in that exact same.

24:56 Speaker 4: Yeah, why why not? I mean, what is this like a morphine? I mean, it's just like a uh a transformer.

25:02 Speaker 2: Well I would I would just say that a lot of people have pointed to that as an example of evidence that it's not a you know, fixed craft with fixed lights on it. So, you know, some people might be arguing that this is like a t R three B type craft, but as you'll see it in the videos, these lights do change in configurations, so it's not. We can we can rule out that it is a fixed body craft with fixed lights on it.

25:31 Speaker 3: And so why would why would the Aliens have big bright orange lights as uh like, why would like what would be the purpose of.

25:39 Speaker 2: That, Well, we can get to that later. Let's just go through the videos. I don't know. I can't. I'm not just I can't say what their purpose was.

25:50 Speaker 1: So this is a ventfite number two.

25:56 Speaker 3: Those are not a womb all right?

25:58 Speaker 1: I want to pause it right there, Right off the bat, we have someone saying those are not illom rounds. Now, why is it not showing you guys the videos?

26:10 Speaker 2: It was showing it, but now it's not.

26:14 Speaker 3: All right.

26:14 Speaker 6: I am just gonna go to the the read honestly for this one, because you have lead out here much better.

26:25 Speaker 3: There isn't anything in there that is.

26:30 Speaker 1: So why.

26:33 Speaker 2: Those are not illumin rounds because limb rounds fall?

26:36 Speaker 1: Okay, so those are not illum rounds because loom round ball. Why does he say that? If why can you explain, Grider, why a marine in the setting that that they're in would would say that so quickly, so assertively.

27:00 Speaker 4: I mean, I have no idea why you said that. But what he's saying, I mean, if that's at the beginning of the sighting, it's like these things fall pretty slowly. I mean they only fall it, you know, like four meters a second. You know, some even fall.

27:14 Speaker 2: You know, it wasn't the beginning of the sighting. So I can correct you right there, It wasn't the beginning.

27:19 Speaker 3: Of the sighting anyway when he looked at it, right.

27:21 Speaker 2: No, no, So if you look at the timeline, if you bring up the timeline that Corbell published.

27:28 Speaker 4: Line says these things were only up there for ten minutes, if you want to look at the official timeline, I have that that.

27:34 Speaker 1: Like, well, we'll get well, we'll get we'll get to.

27:37 Speaker 2: My point is if we that when the recording first started was not when the event first started. So this wasn't the beginning.

27:46 Speaker 5: Of the event.

27:48 Speaker 3: That guy's saying that how long has he been watching the flares?

27:51 Speaker 2: We don't don't we don't know.

27:54 Speaker 1: We don't know, Okay, and that's a you know what that's that that I would I would have to say that that is valid. We don't know how long he had the person has been watching. I mean, but it just seems weird that that's the first thing out of his mouth.

28:15 Speaker 4: That's the that's on camera, you know, like the first thing that's on camera. Like we don't know if that's the first thing out of his mouth, just the first thing on camera.

28:23 Speaker 3: The clip could be cut, you know. The thing is that like good point him? I mean Yeah, it's just good. But I think it's kind of looking into it too much. And he says, oh, well, you know they don't shoot enough five gun section, which is very very I mean in a five gun battery. It's true, a battery is you know, four artillery pieces, uh, two per two per platoon. But you know aircraft they always drop in five. Well not I take that back, not always, but typically they drop in five. Uh.

28:54 Speaker 4: And I'll have plenty of video evidence to show that you know that that's the case here.

28:59 Speaker 3: Once we get on farther down the line.

29:01 Speaker 1: So okay, and we're watching here for thirty six, I see no elevation drop, no visible elevation or smoke trails. I just want to ask, is that normal?

29:23 Speaker 2: I think it could be normal because this is only thirty seconds, and you're not going to see a lot of movement in thirty seconds, even if it were flares. And we don't have a point of reference, so we can't see the mountain range, so we can't really even measure if it was falling or not.

29:39 Speaker 4: And those are infrared flares, those are lou nineteen flares. And I have the documents to prove this, and I have the whole gestation that shows comparison side by side, like shooting side by side in the same video of infrared and normal. So those are IR flares and IR flares. They have a much smaller visible side.

29:59 Speaker 2: Yeah, they're invisible to the naked eye. That would wait, they're not they're not. I IR flares.

30:06 Speaker 3: Not be fair.

30:07 Speaker 1: I AR flares are are I are flares? Uh naked to the invisible to the naked eye.

30:16 Speaker 4: Yes, okay, well let's just go on and squash this right now. The very last video that I posted, number thirty one, it's a one minute, zero eight second going to play that please if you can, and then we can come back to this, because that way we can go on and get this out of the way. This is IR verse.

30:34 Speaker 3: This is now. These are hand flares, Like I think these are hand flares. They may be out of like a some some some type of launcher, but it's definitely fire from the ground. But it's still it's thirty one yeah, and it's actually grider.

30:48 Speaker 2: Do you mind if we just stay focused on the videos and then we can come back, I mean, debate, you may point.

30:53 Speaker 3: We don't want that point to kind of you know, kind of.

30:56 Speaker 2: We're come back. We can come back to it. Grider claims their I are players. I claim that they're not flaes.

31:03 Speaker 1: I want to watch I want to watch the video.

31:07 Speaker 2: Okay, go ahead.

31:09 Speaker 1: Can you see it?

31:12 Speaker 2: No?

31:13 Speaker 1: No, can you see it?

31:16 Speaker 3: Yes?

31:17 Speaker 2: Yes, So give us some context, cure Wrider. What what are we looking at the content?

31:22 Speaker 1: I mean it's this is this is the video's these are I are flares.

31:27 Speaker 3: I are flares at the top, and then those at the top and then okay, okay, somebody fire them.

31:35 Speaker 4: Hold on, you'll see like another round of firing here in like a second.

31:39 Speaker 3: Right now, you'll see they're firing them, I think with their hand. They may be fire fireworks.

31:45 Speaker 2: No fireworks.

31:47 Speaker 3: Those are not fireworks. Now you're going to make me prove that flares are these are not those are not?

31:53 Speaker 1: Those aren't fireworks? Arthur, Yeah, I mean, Arthur, those are those are.

31:57 Speaker 3: Are at the top, and then actually.

32:00 Speaker 1: I think that's where they got if I'm not mistaken. If you guys look closely, I'm pretty sure the picture earlier is you could see the fucking men right there. This is from the picture I showed earlier.

32:18 Speaker 2: Is the description a description on that video.

32:22 Speaker 3: Look look, look, look, look.

32:25 Speaker 1: During the exact same spot we have we have by the way, by the way, we have over seven hundred and fifty people here really, so yeah, we were like shadow Band on YouTube, but we have a lot of people.

32:45 Speaker 3: So I don't know.

32:45 Speaker 1: Yeah, but but I okay, I want to go back to this video.

32:50 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, those are fireworks. I don't Those are civilian fireworks. Those aren't military anything.

33:02 Speaker 3: Arthur, you're digging your own grave.

33:03 Speaker 2: Man right now. Well, what's the description of the event? Is there a description on this video?

33:09 Speaker 1: You can see and and and one of my main issues with the twenty nine pops case was that you could see two different types of lights. Now, the orange we see here, but we also see dimmer white lights that are in formation on the side. Now I'm not crediting Grider, but I am saying that there's two distinct sets of flares there in separate formations, and so it is possible and those those are very much different. Those those look very different.

33:57 Speaker 2: There. Yeah, there are different types of fireworks.

34:00 Speaker 3: Because warm up to Arthur Man, I got like.

34:03 Speaker 2: They make fireworks. If you didn't know that they make and what's the description of this video? Is there a description.

34:14 Speaker 1: Uh no, not they're shooting another Look, look they're shooting them in formation.

34:20 Speaker 2: Yeah.

34:21 Speaker 3: Yeah, those would be the worst fireworks ever.

34:23 Speaker 1: Man, Yeah they're not. It's like those are fireworks you're.

34:30 Speaker 3: Trying to celebrate, like you know, I don't know, I don't know. I can't even make a joke.

34:33 Speaker 1: Right now, but I will say, grinder, there's so much smoke in this picture, in this video that.

34:44 Speaker 3: Like, just like pasition to the lighting is the biggest thing.

34:49 Speaker 1: That when I come back to this, I'm like.

34:54 Speaker 3: Ah yeah, because so I would seem.

35:02 Speaker 4: Like, go back and look at the I R flares, you know, the ones in the back, they weren't.

35:06 Speaker 2: There, weren't weren't flares.

35:10 Speaker 1: Smoke from them, I'll bet you well. From this particular from this particular angle, we can see even from both both sets of flares I can see coming from them. But I can see that they're falling very quick. Not not quick. I would definitely say the orange colored flares fall very much faster. But these over here, I don't know if you guys can see my cursor, but these flares, they do maintain an altitude for a much longer a set of time. But I still see smoke trails coming from them. Now, I'm not just cutting in so again, situational could be different.

35:55 Speaker 1: I'm open to that. All I'm saying is there is something, there is something different about what we're seeing here and what we're seeing there. Right the however they drop them, if they are flares, they dropped them in some other way.

36:19 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, And Mick West will say that the reason you can't see the smoke trails is because these quote unquote IR flares were launched six miles away from Camp Wilson, in the middle of a range between Camp Wilson and it's something called the training village. So do you kind of agree with that that narrative.

36:41 Speaker 3: No, I do not, Like I know nothing about what Mick West said.

36:45 Speaker 2: How far away do you think these I R flares, what you're calling IR flares were launched.

36:52 Speaker 3: No idea. I mean I would assume. I mean, basically, it's a question of altitude. I think with the I R flares, the IR flares, I think we're shot at a pretty high altitude or were dropped by the what I would prove to be MB twenty.

37:05 Speaker 4: Two ospray I think is the maybe AB two. It's basically the ospray. Yeah, like I have the documents and yeah, as far as all.

37:15 Speaker 2: Right, okay, so you don't you don't have a claim. You don't have a claim about the distance that these are. You're just leaving that open.

37:23 Speaker 3: No, I do not.

37:23 Speaker 4: But they have to be close enough to be to be photographed by the FOYA photographer, you know, the Marine Corps photographer who took the photos.

37:32 Speaker 2: That's seventeen miles yeah, at the training but the training village that the FOYA photos were taken at, whereas seventeen miles away from Camp Wilson.

37:44 Speaker 3: Yeah, that sounds good.

37:46 Speaker 2: Sure, So somewhere in the mid midpoint between Camp Wilson and the training village is where I guess most of the skeptics are saying these five quote unquote IR flares were dropped.

38:00 Speaker 3: You're debating me, man, me, I don't know what skeptics are saying.

38:04 Speaker 1: Yeah, so let's yeah, yeah, so so let's keep it to let's try to keep Mick West out of it as much as we can, just because we don't want to bring in uh, potential information that we don't all have. Because I don't have all Mick West's case file on this as well. All right, and so let's try to keep it to what the what the facts that we have are. Now, I'm going to restart this video in particular because I did mute it, so I want to uh unmute it and start it from the beginning. This is again.

38:48 Speaker 2: Wait, yeah, you're sharing it, but the audio is off.

38:59 Speaker 1: I get a re add it. Unfortunately, when you h

39:15 Speaker 1: can you hear it?

39:18 Speaker 2: I cannot. I can't see it either. Now you can't.

39:26 Speaker 3: It's moving.

39:28 Speaker 2: Actually, start from the beginning.

39:33 Speaker 3: Those are not allom.

39:34 Speaker 2: Round because the limb rounds fall.

39:36 Speaker 1: So hard to keep it m m.

39:39 Speaker 3: And nobody shoots in a five gun section.

39:46 Speaker 1: I want to bring one more thing up. So he said, no one shoots in a five gun A five guns section, five gun section. You grinder brought that up earlier. So it kind of goes to show you that these guys did either didn't know what was going on that night, or again, maybe they're accomplice is to uh like some sort of I don't want to say lie, but uh uh leaning home.

40:24 Speaker 3: To the home maybe uh maybe, I mean you'd be surprised, how you know, how little people pay attention. You know what I'm saying, I mean, right.

40:33 Speaker 1: Right, but they but so he but this this gentleman knows that they're they weren't shot, right, first of all, And you're saying that they weren't shot either. You're saying if these are flares, and they are flares, you're saying that they were dropped from an osprey.

40:53 Speaker 3: They were one dropped from an osprey.

40:55 Speaker 1: Not shot.

40:57 Speaker 3: I mean they were shot out of an osprey, but you.

41:00 Speaker 1: Know, but not shot from the ground, is what I'm saying.

41:04 Speaker 3: Not the five. No, definitely not the five that we see. Absolutely, okay, just thank you.

41:10 Speaker 1: For clearing that up.

41:11 Speaker 7: No, you can see like an outline or something.

41:15 Speaker 1: Again, I want to pause. I hate doing this. Can you both comment on that we know or a fact with our eyes? And like I did it last night, there was a full moon last night. I pointed my camera to the full moon. Even though I have an iPhone fifteen brand new, newest model. The moon shows up like a glowing ball of light. You can't get any definition. Saying they see an outline? Can you accommodate that, grider,

41:55 Speaker 1: what would make for an out What would accommodate for the outline that they're seeing? Because it sounds like they're saying they're seeing an outline of a craft.

42:04 Speaker 3: Yes, it will play I mean smoke like distance, you know.

42:08 Speaker 2: Okay, okay, And and I would say that they're telling the truth and they know what they're seeing, and that you know this highly credible military witness says he saw an outline. I believe he saw an outline.

42:24 Speaker 3: It's moving.

42:27 Speaker 1: Again. Take me to your leader. It's kind of on the nose.

42:44 Speaker 2: We got UFOs outside.

42:48 Speaker 7: Everyone's out here.

42:51 Speaker 1: Everybody's out here, all right, Grider, and are there that video? I've to be the testimony in it. Plus how for thirty six seconds we I mean we watched your video, Grinder, those in this video. This craft, I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of just like you know, roll it across. It doesn't seem like they're falling. It seems like they're actually moving unless the camera orientation is moving. It looks like moving up instead of down. That now, could that be wind?

43:38 Speaker 2: Yeah?

43:38 Speaker 4: I mean, can you think about it, like both of you,

43:42 Speaker 4: they're dropped over like the top of a mountain, so you have the updraft, you know how you like you get turbulence when you like fly over, you know, like a mountain range. You get that updraft, that turbulence you know of air. It's the same thing. And also, I mean their parachute flares, they function like a hot air balloon. It's it's hot air going up into a parachute. It provides a lift would be mine.

44:04 Speaker 3: They answer.

44:06 Speaker 2: Parachute flaares one hundred percent go down all the time. They'd never go up. They're not designed to go up. They're not designed to hover. They're designed to go down.

44:19 Speaker 1: But we do know that sometimes the phosporus or whatever is burning in the parachute, it can act like a hot air balloon, right, which would allow it to maintain at least.

44:35 Speaker 2: That's kind of like a Chinese a Chinese lantern type idea. That's the idea of what you're kind of describing. These just don't have the same sort of set up as a Chinese lantern. The distance from the parachute to the flair that's pretty far, so it's not collecting hot air in the same way as the Chinese lantern does, so they're completely different. You might be getting some draft from the heat from the flare, but it's not gonna be enough to counteract the weight of the actual flare itself.

45:09 Speaker 1: Gorod or anything to comment. No, nope, all right, so let's move on. Then, all right the.

45:21 Speaker 2: Video three video damna video three?

45:36 Speaker 7: What is the sheet?

45:42 Speaker 1: All right? So you do get a frame of reference.

45:49 Speaker 2: Now it's not showing up in my camera. So that's interesting. At the very end, he says, now it's not showing up in my camera, and someone right next to him said, yeah, the same. So we got two people recording at the same time.

46:07 Speaker 1: Mm hmm, not being visible to the camera. Could that be?

46:18 Speaker 1: Could it be that the ir is is is playing tricks on the camera, ir Flair if it were to be a flare rider, I.

46:32 Speaker 4: Mean, I would think that if it's like, if it's a cell phone camera, cell phone cameras can see ir you know, that's like olkay. So back in the day, a big thing that I was trying to do is break the Cannonball Run, which is like going from the East coast to the West coast non stop as fast as possible, you know, and the car just NonStop, you know, going from the Red Ball Garage and downtown uh in a downtown uh downtown New York City to the port A Fino end on the West Coast and uh so, I like had built my car up with a bunch of anti speed enforcement countermeasures, and I had jammers, so they would jam laser, they would jam light R And what they did is they used infra red.

47:18 Speaker 4: They matched the pulse the IR pulse of like the cops gun, so that it kind of just like diffused it. And the way that I would test my jammers to see if they were working is I would pull out my my cell phone and I would just look with my camera and then I would use like a testerer to basically activate the jammers, and.

47:38 Speaker 3: I would be able to see the pulses of light.

47:40 Speaker 4: It's the same thing like you can see IR light, you know, just barely, but you can still see it with a cell phone camera. I'm not too sure about like normal cameras if you're able to see if they have IR filters, I doubt it, but I could be wrong.

47:55 Speaker 2: So but the I, the I can't see IR.

47:58 Speaker 3: The I can't snod, So that's not true. The eye can if it's in the eighth and fifty M. I don't know what NM stands for, it's like the measurement nanometer.

48:10 Speaker 4: Yeah, but if you go down to like seven fifty. Then it's completely invisible. I don't know what nanometer these are, you know, the the I R flares.

48:20 Speaker 1: Are though, So we and where I paused it. Uh, ironically, it kind of comes back into frame and we have a faint light but we're missing one, but we know where it would be be right about here. Oh I find that to be interesting. Let's play it through the rest of the video and there it comes.

48:50 Speaker 3: What is this?

48:51 Speaker 1: Shepa So, yeah, it gives us a frame of reference.

49:04 Speaker 2: Now it's not showing up in my camera.

49:08 Speaker 1: Okay, so we.

49:09 Speaker 2: Are commented on this, so let's go to the next Yeah, no, no.

49:12 Speaker 1: I don't I just wanted to see it again. This is the video four? Correct?

49:29 Speaker 2: If it says video four, then yeah, I think we were on video three, but now we're gonna be on four.

49:35 Speaker 1: Are you guys?

49:36 Speaker 2: Not with me?

49:37 Speaker 3: Oh?

49:38 Speaker 2: I'm with you, but I can't see it.

49:41 Speaker 1: That's the hardest part, guys, I'm so sorry, is trying to balance like getting these videos up and down.

49:49 Speaker 3: You're doing great, man, You're absolutely doing great time.

49:54 Speaker 1: Thank you. All right, So this is so we need to go back to what video for?

50:02 Speaker 3: All right?

50:03 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, this one's interesting. Can you you guys can see it right?

50:08 Speaker 2: Yep?

50:13 Speaker 7: I told you research notis for real?

50:19 Speaker 1: Got some weird comments, there's more lights around it.

50:25 Speaker 5: Okay, that's it.

50:38 Speaker 1: All right? Okay, I want to throw it to I want to throw it to Arthur. Can you tell me what you think is significant about this clip?

50:54 Speaker 2: Well, Uh, the most important thing, which is in pretty much every clip, is that they're all baffled by what they're seeing. They're not able to identify what they're seeing. So, whether you want to argue this was Flar's or not, it's indisputable that the witnesses at the time of the event, while they're witnessing in real time, could not identify what they were seeing, even though they're trained military witnesses.

51:22 Speaker 1: Okay, and do you think it's odd that one of the military personnel talks about research into aliens? Do you think there could be a bias here? And maybe some degree of what Grider is saying makes sense when he says that a hoax could be bringing Maybe maybe a hoax wasn't planned, but they end up seeing weird lights in the sky right that they didn't understand or know about that it was going to happen. Right, they are actually just flares. But the the guy like me who's clearly in that that platoon or battalion or whatever, who does want to believe.

52:22 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, I think confirmation bias is something everyone has. I could definitely, I can definitely see that maybe one person who might be a respective person in the group might say that's a UFO. There's no way that's anything but a UFO. You could see how there could be some group group thing happening within within the you know, that little cluster there. But my pushback to that, which is important is that we don't just have one location. We have multiple locations hundreds of feet away from each other where you can hear the people commenting on the event, and uh, it would have to be some sort of mass hallucination at that point, because you can't you couldn't attribute that to like one individual starting up, you know, a thought within everyone else, because it's happening in two different locations far away from each other, so they're they're separated from one another, meaning that it's not just one person that's causing this.

53:25 Speaker 1: Okay, And and again you know I I I think that that's what's amazing about the military is is people from all different backgrounds. And I don't think just because you look into aliens and and you're into the topic means that you know nothing that you say about a sighting is credible. So Grider, this clip does it stand out at all to you?

53:59 Speaker 3: And besides the sparking, right, if I'm not mistaken, that's the one that it sparks right, you know because I was watching it. But I can see, you know, like yeah, yeah, like my eyes are bad and you know, I mean I can't really tell, but those flashes I found out what those are. Those are chaff. That's what that is. It's chaff. And I've got lights.

54:24 Speaker 2: Where the running lights for the craft launching the shaft.

54:29 Speaker 3: You don't typically run with your lights on when you're training for combat.

54:33 Speaker 2: Yes, you absolutely do. No, you get you required a.

54:39 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean run lights just not true. It's not true.

54:44 Speaker 4: When you're on a military base doing you know, doing an air training exercise, preparing for combat, you do not. You train for combat like you're in combat. You don't have your running lights on, you have them off. You absolutely run dark.

54:58 Speaker 3: Now, if they were to leave the restricted airs space and enter the civilian you know, air highways.

55:04 Speaker 4: I forgot what they call them. Uh then yeah, they absolutely would. They would turn on their ads B and they would turn on the running lights. Yeah, but absolutely.

55:13 Speaker 2: Definitely this is something we could look up.

55:15 Speaker 3: We could look I was gonna say, I can tell you because I've like I mean, because I've trained for combat, and that's you don't you were never running dark. I've been inside of an aircraft at night training like we've done sling loads, we've done airsoults. Not.

55:34 Speaker 2: We can come back to this an objective This is an objective fact that we could find this work.

55:40 Speaker 3: So it's not on the other This isn't an opinion. It's just not an opinion. You train like you fight. And those pilots are wearing nods, they're they're wearing a night vision goggles and they have well okay.

55:56 Speaker 2: So my my claim is that aircraft on twenty nine Palms would have running lights operational one hundred percent of the time, and the claim from writer is that sometimes they do not have their running lights.

56:13 Speaker 3: On all the time. Hey, there's a Foyer photo from from John Greenwald from this Foyer release where it shows an ospray flying with its lights off over the camera actually, I'll send it to you right.

56:28 Speaker 2: Now for photos. So if blinking running lights might not be captured in a photo.

56:37 Speaker 1: So I looked up. So I did look it up. So military aircraft actually aren't bound by FAA rules. They have their own set of rules to follow. Having said that, though their rules are basically followed fa rules with a few exceptions. Yes, one of those exceptions is for lights. Military aircraft can turn off their lights after dark, but only if they're actually flying a mission in an active war zone or if they're doing training in an area that's been cleared of other aircraft and that's happening to FAAR ninety one dot two.

57:27 Speaker 2: Okay, well I'm wrong, Thanks for the fact check. So you're right, Wright, it could have been an aircraft with no running lights launching checks.

57:37 Speaker 1: Anti collision lights need not be lit when the pilot in command determines that because operating conditions would being the interest of safety to turn the lights off. Those are other instances.

57:53 Speaker 3: Hey, So like my like A big part of my case, of my counterpoints is that there was a major air exercise going on at this exact same time. There was multiple air assets. I'm talking about helicopters, they were doing what's called a gosh, what's it called. I don't have the paper pulled up, but like they were doing a major air refueling. They were doing counter air, like counter air with like actual contractors flying like a HIND, which is a you know, which is a big chopper that you know is it's like the attack helicopter for the Russians, it's called the HIND, the twenty eight.

58:31 Speaker 3: They were flying an I twenty eight during this exercise as like an opposing force, as an OP four. They were also flying a couple of I think it was four different fighter jets, the F one fighter jet as like an opposing force. There was dozens of air assets that were flying helicopters, planes and you know jets that were flying within this airspace in this exact same hour time period, like right at.

58:58 Speaker 1: This I would need to see that, all right, So I guess we'll get it, and.

59:03 Speaker 2: I would not argue with the fact that there was training occurring at a military training base that's happening continuously all the time.

59:16 Speaker 1: Okay, this is location B Camp Wilson, So okay, okay, So the next video about to see is when we start seeing other flares in the same sky as the lights, Like, let's just call lights, say either way, uh, because that'd be siding with one of you. So I'm gonna pull this up. Let's add it in so you can see that orange light right away, right from right from there.

1:00:00 Speaker 7: Yeah, please tell me this at the end of the world.

1:00:09 Speaker 1: I just want to point out that that's a very odd statement for someone to say.

1:00:17 Speaker 3: That's clearly being funny.

1:00:20 Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, and here are a lot of people not why don't you pose it?

1:00:32 Speaker 1: Oh one second, I'll go back. I'll go back.

1:00:40 Speaker 2: Because a lot of people might not be able to see the five lights you got kind of pointed out to them. Yes, you got the two flares, go ahead, Yeah.

1:00:50 Speaker 1: So we have all right, so we have the two very very distinct flares. Now these be recognized, right.

1:01:02 Speaker 3: They they fired.

1:01:05 Speaker 4: Yeah, those are fired by artillery. Like those are actual like artillery or maybe even a mortar. They had artillery, and they had a couple of mortars that were you know, set up at this time period for this field training exercise.

1:01:19 Speaker 1: Okay, and these are the flares that you would have more training with, right, It's the.

1:01:28 Speaker 4: Same ones that we you know that we fire in combat. But yeah, those are what those are what indirect fire illumination rounds look like. Uh, mostly fired from like an eighty millimeter one twenty milimeter mortar are maybe even like a one twenty one oh five or one twenty millimeter howitzer.

1:01:44 Speaker 3: I don't know if they have one twenties and the marine corps, but probably the one of five.

1:01:50 Speaker 1: Okay, but right below it about maybe six inches you see the one two through for five lights And they're still here now they have significantly significantly either backed up or the orientation is just so dramatically different that we are that that the camera position is altering our perspective to a degree where we see where we think that it's further away. But still these things, uh grinder, I gotta ask players now, granted, if they were dropped from an osprey or not, why would they still all be in the same now that they could be falling together right at the same rate of speed.

1:02:49 Speaker 1: But b why why are they still in the same perfect formation and not not like we saw in the other videos when they start trailing out.

1:02:59 Speaker 3: They're not.

1:03:00 Speaker 4: If you go to if you want to quick go to picture number sixteen in the media tab, you can see the exact the exact photo of the flares, and you can see this is from the Foya the Yeah, this is from the Foyer release. And you see I've got a collage a pretty high rates.

1:03:20 Speaker 2: And I just want to preface I want to push back on on these Foya photos. I have a whole these are the photos here, These are Foya photos. I have a whole trunch of research that I hope we can get to, which I am claiming proof.

1:03:37 Speaker 1: I'll stay here. Oh goddamn night. Hey, all right, but let's go. Let's let's go.

1:03:46 Speaker 2: These are the Foyer photos taken from the training village seventeen miles away from Camp Wilson, allegedly at the same time.

1:03:58 Speaker 3: But I can argue this conspiracy angle.

1:04:00 Speaker 2: This is like the well, well, you can argue the points that I'll make. I'll make I'll make my specific points why I think hold on, hold on, and then you can retort those hold on?

1:04:12 Speaker 1: Are these I'm sorry, I I think I'm confused.

1:04:17 Speaker 4: The different photos of that night, of that exact night fire from the opposite side of that mountain. Uh, these were taken by a Marine Corps journalists or like it's like the job in the Marine Corps and maybe right right right, yeah, yeah, So you see the top three are the I R flares.

1:04:40 Speaker 2: And now they're not IR flares. IR flares aren't.

1:04:45 Speaker 3: No, they're not. I've already proven that, Arthur. I mean, I mean, I don't know how Okay, yeah, I don't think. I mean, I can go on and I have three more videos showing IR flares visible, and two of them are in a daylight setting.

1:04:58 Speaker 2: So if you want to now, I mean, check your sources.

1:05:03 Speaker 4: Okay, okay, we then let's go on and go to the videos right now, tylot, go to video number.

1:05:09 Speaker 3: It's right up. Go to video number fourteen, Video fourteen. This is why ATK this is a manufacturer of lou nineteen IR flares, and this.

1:05:22 Speaker 2: Is I wanted to seek the description. Let's start by looking at out.

1:05:25 Speaker 3: I want to look at the description, absolutely absolutely, and I'll find the point of drop while you show the description.

1:05:34 Speaker 2: Maybe so, for more than forty years.

1:05:38 Speaker 1: ATK, as you did, yeah, I will uh. For more than forty years, ATK has produced illuminating devices for search and rescue, military support, and border patrol. ATK flares are instrumental in providing warfighters with technology that gives them the cutting edge in the out a field aid search and rescue operators as they save lives, as well as many other applications produced to illuminate in both the visible and infrared spectrum. These innovative products are used by the government and commercial entities in more than twenty five countries.

1:06:21 Speaker 4: Ty, this is the wrong video. I'm sorry, man, Like I I I mean, I must have linked the wrong video. This is the the wrong Like, this isn't the right video.

1:06:32 Speaker 3: So wait, I mean you're probably talking about no I think that.

1:06:42 Speaker 4: I like, no, that's like a that's a flair burning on the ground that I included just to point out the fact that they only dropped these over deserts. If you give me a second, Well, if you give me, yeah, I'll go back to my YouTube and I'll find the specific video and we can go back.

1:06:57 Speaker 2: Uh yeah, well we can come back to this. Let's get through these videos. You know, we're gonna we're gonna come back to a lot of stuff once we get through the videos.

1:07:06 Speaker 1: Right, right, So while you while you're doing that, I'm gonna pull the videos back up. Sorry, guys, Okay, location, this is this is the one after, right, I.

1:07:32 Speaker 2: Think it's location A, Location B or the last two videos and then the response video. Yeah, this is the last video.

1:07:43 Speaker 3: Of the Hey, I think they know we're looking at them anyway. Is that what? Those are flares? That we know those are flares? But what the fuck are those bright lights?

1:08:15 Speaker 2: Posets?

1:08:16 Speaker 3: Yeah, we know those are flare.

1:08:20 Speaker 2: So several of them say those are flares. We know those are flares, but what the fuck are those bright lights? I think it's exact quote.

1:08:30 Speaker 1: And again again where they're staying in that same formation.

1:08:38 Speaker 2: That go back a little bit. This isn't very clear right there.

1:08:42 Speaker 3: Go back.

1:08:46 Speaker 4: Here's one thing to point out to you is that when you're firing an indirect fire, when you're firing like an illumination round, it produces debris when it separates. When that round separates and opens up to where it's a parachute flair, you know, it's like there's some debris, like there's stuff that could get caught inside of an aircraft air intake that would bring up that would potentially bring an aircraft down, So they would never fire, they would never clear like an artillery gun to shoot an illumination round up over a potentially you know, manned or unmanned aircraft.

1:09:25 Speaker 3: It just would not happen. It would not happen. It would never happen.

1:09:31 Speaker 1: So what you're saying is you can see a light. Yeah, so so, and actually in this video one light does seem to have dropped exactly.

1:09:44 Speaker 2: And if you compare that to the famous photo the the low light iPhone phos that you were showing earlier, it's the same same configuration, yes, right here exactly. So that's this shape which is interesting. The Yeah, which is interesting because we have two videos of roughly the exact same time, because the flares are up in the air and that only lasted like one minute that they had footage of that. So why are we seeing a drastic change in the shape if, in other words the ship. The only reason this shape could be changing so drastically if it was at the same time, is because it's the function of perspective, meaning that the two different locations on the base or say like three hundred yards away from each other, to the left and right, And it's that perspective change that's causing the shift in the in the shape of the video, not the actual lights changing themselves.

1:10:54 Speaker 3: Hey, So, one thing I want to point out to the to the people that are watching, is that I'm not a debunker. I'm actually a believer. I'm a skeptic. But I've had in basic training, I had my own i had a triangle a triangular craft fly about thirty five feet over my head. So like, I'm not a debunker. You know, this is not I know it may seem like I am right now, but I just want to I probably should have said that at the beginning.

1:11:19 Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean, listen, I've I've had intelligence community people come up to me and tell me this is a training exercise and that I shouldn't be wasting my time, essentially multiple but then others that have said that there's something else going on here and that it is something. So it seems that there's a clear disconnect between this this cave uh and and and the the narrative that is that's going around. So I am just I there. I do want to get into the military response a little bit later and and and that aspect, but I'm sorry I did.

1:12:15 Speaker 1: Someone just walked in, so I kind of lost my train of thought there. But my my big thing about this is how are these guys, what is there any situation Grider, where these people stage at Camp Wilson would not be informed of a base wide drill.

1:12:44 Speaker 1: I mean, does that make sense to you?

1:12:47 Speaker 3: Want to get I have the exactly Okay, give me a second to pull up, so I have the exact number of aircraft that were in the air.

1:12:58 Speaker 2: You're diverting. His question is would the men at Camp Wilson be in your opinion, would the soldiers who are getting ready to go to bed that night be informed of a massive training exercise that night?

1:13:17 Speaker 1: That's the question.

1:13:18 Speaker 3: Yes, if they were not a part of it, probably not. Probably not like this, you know, like maybe the officers, but like why would they announce if there's other units, like they got done with their stuff for the day, Like why would they be Hey guys, you know you know y'all have been out training all day. You're tired. Oh we hey, you know, like let's have a deep briefing about what some other units doing. No, Like they wouldn't care. They wouldn't care at all.

1:13:45 Speaker 2: So you think if it was separate units, they wouldn't be in They wouldn't know a separate units.

1:13:50 Speaker 3: Yeah, well you don't.

1:13:51 Speaker 2: You don't know that it was absolutely separate units, but I mean in.

1:13:55 Speaker 3: Your unit would be out there.

1:13:59 Speaker 1: I just I just find it. And fifty. Again, that's what liberally we're saying fifty because I think that area I've been trying to look into it, but it houses I think Arthur and I what was it like, somewhere upwards of three hundred.

1:14:19 Speaker 2: I couldn't get you the exact numbers of people, but I would say in the hundreds that they witness.

1:14:24 Speaker 1: If it was full.

1:14:26 Speaker 2: Yeah, so.

1:14:29 Speaker 1: I think that, yeah, yeah, so you know, fair enough, fair enough. I'm just saying that it seems very, very weird that from the people that have come forward and from the sounds that you hear in some of the videos, like like the chaos that you can hear in the back not chaos. It's not like they're freaking out, but you can hear a lot of people, like you know, yelling and screaming. It just seems that there's a lot of people that were informed. And if we're to believe that this was a massive training exercise, right, a base wide training exercise that involved a convoy of fifty to seventy trucks, jets, helicopters, flares, more flares that somehow stay in a v for god knows how long.

1:15:29 Speaker 1: It just seems weird to me that the base wouldn't know that some sort of memo wouldn't go out saying, by the way, just so you know this is going to be happening at this hour, at this time, at this place, you know, you know, just be.

1:15:51 Speaker 3: For safety reasons for one, safety for what those guys are, Like those guys are on Camp Wilson or on at that exact same time. All right, So at the exact same time, at that exact time, right at right at eight o'clock, there was an air okay, what's called an eighty g R a d g R, an air delivered ground refueling exercise. There was what's called a farp F a r P, which is a Ford Arming Refueling point exercise which includes ground units going to secure and set up a refueling point. Uh. There was a there were two different objectives that were being uh you know, uh, that were being bounded down upon, that were being taken uh in some type of close quarters combat you know, training exercise.

1:16:44 Speaker 3: There was another a d g R, this one being a tar T a a R or a tilt rotor air to air refueling. So there was air to air refueling going on for the tilt rotor, which is osprey. Then there was a r h A a ARE, which was a helicopter air to air refueling, which is I mean, so there were three different types of refuel actually four different types of refueling exercises that were going on. And on top of that, there was close air, there was counter air that was going on, there was defensive Op four air that was in.

1:17:17 Speaker 3: I mean, this is like a major training event, guys. I mean, I'm talking about dozens of aircraft like in the air. You know there. I mean, there's no way that they didn't know. There's no way. I mean, there's just no way.

1:17:30 Speaker 2: So you're saying they did know.

1:17:34 Speaker 3: And again, there's no way that they didn't know. All these aircraft were in the air. Aircraft are allowed, helicopters.

1:17:39 Speaker 2: Who didn't know, There's no way who didn't know, do you? I mean the the Marines, so the witnesses. So you're saying the witnesses did know that there was a major exercise that night and are lying about it.

1:17:52 Speaker 1: They were don't try to make this way, well, well, circling back, I am not I'm not I'm speaking literally gibberish. Right now, that sounds like what you were just insinuating. I'm strictly Joe Rogan right now, that sounded like what you were saying. So I don't know what. Okay, So maybe there's just maybe their words just aren't coming out right.

1:18:29 Speaker 3: They were a part of the major training exercise like those like but you just told us. I'm saying that, like the Grand exercise, like that's what they're doing their training, like they're on that based training. They were in their downtime. They may not have been a part of like the air exercise, but they were absolutely a part of the overall training environment, like.

1:18:49 Speaker 2: You're training every single day writer, that's what they're there to do.

1:18:54 Speaker 3: They're training exactly.

1:18:56 Speaker 1: Yeah, but that would also go against the notion. Hmm, okay, all right, all right, all right, there's that one more. Uh, there's a couple of photos I believe right now, I would like to show those photos for a specific Pleason video.

1:19:21 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that covers all the videos of the event. There's some photos of the event as well, some low light photos. That's the response the response videos.

1:19:30 Speaker 1: So let's actually.

1:19:33 Speaker 7: So many helicopters.

1:19:35 Speaker 3: They're chasing some they're.

1:19:40 Speaker 7: They're going fast as hell too. They're in like a formation, so many helicopters.

1:19:47 Speaker 1: Twice they're.

1:19:52 Speaker 7: They're going fast as hell too. They're in like a formation.

1:19:58 Speaker 1: All right, I just wanted BEFO, you guys speak. I want to I want to note that what we hear is I don't want to get beamed up, right, So again some sort of reference to UFO. But we also hear one person speaking about a massive response. However, we don't see it. We don't see it specifically. We can hear it a little bit, but we don't know exactly what we're what we're seeing. There's some blinking lights and that that that right there? Does anyone know if that is right there in the lights?

1:20:46 Speaker 2: And no, But all you can see is some blinking lights, which is running lights for some sort of aircraft, probably helicopters. And so there's another example of the aircraft actually using their running lights night.

1:21:00 Speaker 3: So yeah, well, I mean we have a picture of one not using its lights or if it's in that fraction of a second, you.

1:21:06 Speaker 1: Know where the all right, and again we've established that they make that choice.

1:21:12 Speaker 3: Yes, it is possible if they're doing something as high risk as refueling, doing air to air helicopter at helicopter refueling, which is one of the most dangerous things that you can do in the military by far, you know, then they probably would have their running lights on.

1:21:31 Speaker 4: But if you want to go to twenty one and twenty two, you can go to either one. I have a like, I have two different collages of all the different aircraft that were in the area, and I'll as you go over them, I'll give you the number of them that were in the air at this exact moment.

1:21:47 Speaker 2: Well, we can get into the weeds there soon. But are we going to go over the witness testimony as well?

1:21:57 Speaker 1: Yes, I mean yes, I think you can do this justice without it.

1:22:05 Speaker 2: So let's go over the photos. Let's go over the photos and the low light photos. Do you have those?

1:22:11 Speaker 1: I can bring them up, Yeah, if you can, just so I can clear up my tab situation here.

1:22:17 Speaker 2: Yeah, I can do that, no problem.

1:22:20 Speaker 1: So I again, this the massive response element. These people in the video, the video that we just watch specifically, they sound like they have no clue what's happening, and they say it looks like they're chasing something and then the beamed up thing. So again, are we dealing with multiple people hoaxing because these are different angles, clearly different people taking the videos. So I find it hard to believe that this would be a hoax being perpetrated through multiple people.

1:23:07 Speaker 2: That's a very good point, Ty, That's what I was trying to drive home, that we're not dealing And you could maybe make the argument that if it was one group of people at one place, that a hoax could be possible. But when you're talking about multiple locations not connected to each other, that chance of simultaneously multiple groups of people decided to do the exact same hoax at the same time, that seems very unlikely. At that point.

1:23:34 Speaker 3: I mean, you're like, you have no idea what these people were thinking. Yet we're talking about things that we have no way to prove that we have no You have no idea what what they were thinking or what they knew.

1:23:47 Speaker 1: We don't know, And that's a that's an absolutely fair point. So what did you want to what did you want to get by with the hot low resipics?

1:23:59 Speaker 2: Well, just that this is probably the most famous one and there is some sort of shading in the background of this triangle as you can see if the filter applied that there's some sort of looks like the outline of a craft. But maybe it's not. But there is some sort of something filter And a lot of people say, well, that's you know, smoke that's causing that outline to be a pure But I would say, smoke rises up. Smoke rises up, and you can clearly see that there is some sort of shading below the four top the four top lights.

1:24:46 Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know too much. I mean, like, can't that happen when I mean, when you're applying a filter like it, I mean, don't filters.

1:24:54 Speaker 2: You can even see it in the original. You can see it in the original.

1:24:57 Speaker 8: I mean that can be glare, that can be anything, right, I mean as a as a as an expert in photography myself, I would say that it could be an artifact of the camera and if the especially if they're.

1:25:14 Speaker 1: Uh using low exposure. But but and that would that it would it would give like some if this was moving, it would essentially give it some sort of motion blur, but it would it would be more in tune with the light of the the light that the it would be more it wouldn't be dark black like that. So right, But but I'm actually leaning to you, now yeah, well I'm leaning. I'm not, I'm not.

1:25:50 Speaker 2: It could it could be an artifact. I'll grant you that it could be an artifact of the camera.

1:25:57 Speaker 1: That could be the smoke.

1:25:59 Speaker 2: But I will all again, I will argue it against it being the smoke because smoke rises up and there would not be smoked below the lights if they were flares.

1:26:12 Speaker 3: What if there was a gust of wind, you know, there was a gust of wind, right could blow.

1:26:17 Speaker 2: If there was a gust of wind. Number oh you know, Okay, we can argue this point. It's not even that strong. But I would just say this, you know, looks like that it could be the outline of something. And I think that's interesting to at least note. And we'll just go through the different photos.

1:26:33 Speaker 3: I mean, it looks like the light from the flares like reflecting or glaring off of smoke. That's what it looks like to me.

1:26:41 Speaker 2: To me, it looks like Zeta reticulans projecting holograms.

1:26:48 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, I mean, you know it's I the beholder, right, I mean, that's you know, it's our problem here.

1:26:56 Speaker 2: Okay, Well, so that's the most famous low light photo. But we'll get through all the Here's another one. You can kind of see it. It's much smaller in this photo, but you can see the structures as well.

1:27:07 Speaker 1: This one here. We do have a reference point. Can you go back? Yeah, we have a we just went back, all right, so we have a reference point.

1:27:18 Speaker 2: And whatever this this and we actually know exactly where this was taken, if you if I could bring up Google Earth, it's been it's been determined exactly where this was.

1:27:31 Speaker 1: Okay, and it seems like now this is where I get I get a little shaky because I'm not seeing those golden flares in the sky at this point. So have they either fallen down and gone away or have they not been shot yet?

1:27:54 Speaker 2: And they haven't been shot yet, because according to what the witnesses said, the flares shot up, the two flare shot up, and that the after about a minute, the five light formation disappeared.

1:28:09 Speaker 3: Hmmm, they said, floor out right. I just want to make that distinction that they said, quote unquote it blinked. The lights blinked out one by one.

1:28:20 Speaker 2: No, they did not say one by one.

1:28:21 Speaker 1: Well, we can get I got the documents right here, brother, hold on, yeah, if you want to pull them up. But I thought I wasn't saying I thought we listened all the testimony. I don't remember them saying blinking out. I remember them saying that they disappear. Yeah, that's what I remember too, That's what I remember. I'm the modeling.

1:28:45 Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, no, man, I've I've got the transcript. I'll take a screenshot of the transcript and then actually I'll find the clue.

1:28:52 Speaker 2: We're gonna be We're gonna be listening to the witnesses.

1:28:55 Speaker 3: So I know the pain's coming. Don't worry.

1:28:57 Speaker 1: Don't worry the pains companies.

1:29:00 Speaker 2: But we'll go through these other photos. This is another one, a low light photo. This is in this one. It's very symmetrical, extremely symmetrical. So that's just interesting.

1:29:14 Speaker 1: I will give you that that one seems to be taken.

1:29:19 Speaker 3: From a different things that is symmetrical for sure.

1:29:24 Speaker 2: Yeah.

1:29:25 Speaker 1: Yes, again, it confuses me because what time.

1:29:35 Speaker 2: This is different to me? Yes, see the shapes are different between these two, yes, and the lighting is different, and the time of day it seems like it's a different time of day. It's different. Cameras different location, different camera.

1:29:52 Speaker 2: Here's one that's taken through a night vision goggles.

1:29:56 Speaker 1: I did see before.

1:29:58 Speaker 2: You can't really see anything. It's just a giant Can you go back?

1:30:02 Speaker 4: Actually a video there's actually like that's a video, not just a picture, Like that's an actual video.

1:30:06 Speaker 1: When did that?

1:30:08 Speaker 3: Ten seconds? I'll find the video clip.

1:30:09 Speaker 1: Hold on when we didn't get to that. I never saw that picture.

1:30:14 Speaker 2: This this night vision one the binocular.

1:30:17 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's like through a PVS fourteen probably or a PVS seven.

1:30:23 Speaker 1: And is that trained on that object?

1:30:26 Speaker 2: This is l formation.

1:30:29 Speaker 1: Yes, it's coming out as just a big ball of light.

1:30:34 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's from an angle. It's probably from the you know, the side of it. Maybe that that that could actually have been taken from like the helicopter that dropped it, you know, for all the window you can see the building the air.

1:30:46 Speaker 2: This is This is a building on the right. I think this is taken from it. You can see the mountain range.

1:30:50 Speaker 4: The buildings on top of the mountain. Okay, you could be right. That looks like it's higher an elevation. I mean that looks like an upward elevation. They have buildings on the side of the mountains you know down there?

1:31:00 Speaker 1: Yeah, and is that is that a is that a window? Or is this an that?

1:31:08 Speaker 3: Is that what that is?

1:31:10 Speaker 2: Yeah? I think the cell phone and they put it up to the night vision monocular or by night whatever.

1:31:18 Speaker 3: Does that not look like clouds?

1:31:20 Speaker 5: That?

1:31:20 Speaker 3: It's like some clouds to me?

1:31:22 Speaker 1: You see that, there are definitely some clouds.

1:31:24 Speaker 2: You see a little bit of clouds. A little whisky.

1:31:28 Speaker 1: Can I ask what your point with the cloud is.

1:31:32 Speaker 3: I'm just making the point for I can pull it out later, you know, when it you know it's I mean, just you.

1:31:37 Speaker 1: Know, just for future it's relevant, Okay, all right, Yeah, I mean I have.

1:31:41 Speaker 3: No idea when it will be relevant. I'm just making the point.

1:31:45 Speaker 2: Okay. Here's a photo of the guys out there watching it, and I'm just gonna count. I can see one, two, three, I can see four phones.

1:31:56 Speaker 3: And then.

1:31:58 Speaker 1: Count shadows to one. One shadow you can see has a is holding up a phone like this or holding something up. So there's another There's one, two, three, four, five people in the shot that we can't see, but we can see their shadows.

1:32:19 Speaker 2: And this is only one side. There's two sides to these bunks, and each one of these bunks and I think has at least probably like ten people in it.

1:32:27 Speaker 4: Maybe those things are huge. I mean, like I haven't been inside one of those. Those are specific like marine training, you know, uh huts or whatever. But you know they're like right, it's like the half half like cylinders.

1:32:40 Speaker 3: Yeah. Like we had like plywood b huts that are basically it's like a plywood shed basically, and like put Hesco barriers on the side of it, you know, just like big baskets filled with sand and then yeah, you know plywood roof. You know. Yeah, like that's what we had. Sounds like nice, but a lot more probably fit fifty people.

1:32:59 Speaker 1: I would say. It sounds like you guys got the ship end of the stick on that one.

1:33:04 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's yeah, yeah, But I like the marine slept in the same things. You know.

1:33:09 Speaker 4: The ply would be huts down range, you know, but they had nice training you know, like when what we would go to the field, we would just be in inside of like our humbies sleeping.

1:33:19 Speaker 3: You know. We didn't have any of these nice you know, these really nice facilities.

1:33:23 Speaker 1: Okay. Uh So, something I brought up during the podcast that Arthur and I did was these guys are out there and they're skibbies. It's like they ran out there, right. So this is again bringing me back to the point that they it doesn't seem like they knew what was going on, that they're that this was a surprise to them, that holy like, hey, guys, get out here and check this out, right, and then everyone comes out looks like everyone's you know, if you're saying, you know, these men, if this is routine, right, YadA, YadA, YadA, it doesn't seem like they'd be that interested.

1:34:13 Speaker 1: They have other things to do, like maybe they want to catch rack, catch rack for the next day. I don't know, just how many times have you seen people come out like this.

1:34:27 Speaker 4: I mean, that's what we would would hang out outside. It's probably nice and cool. I doubt those things have air conditioning, I don't, you know. I mean it's probably I mean, I guess it was kind of pro like, probably pretty cool.

1:34:38 Speaker 3: But think about it.

1:34:39 Speaker 4: Okay, So there's at least a company, at least one company that's over one hundred and men, I mean probably one hundred and ten, you know, maybe maybe a little bit more, maybe closer to one fifty.

1:34:50 Speaker 3: And that's what maybe fifteen.

1:34:51 Speaker 4: Guys that are outside, you know, hanging out like they're probably smoking a cigarette. You know, it's like you're outside, you know, what else it's her to do, like, you know, go to But the lights are still.

1:35:01 Speaker 3: In the hut.

1:35:02 Speaker 2: And that's not what I see. That's not what I see. I see people barefoot. I see people standing in lines looking up at the sky holding their cell phones, pointing at the what I assume to be the five light formation. I don't see this as a routine, casual gathering outdoor.

1:35:20 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's the last time you've been out in the field with like, you know, a group of like people in the military. You know, it's hang outside, you smoke, you hang out inside, and they're probably wearing their shower shoes.

1:35:32 Speaker 1: Like I don't. I don't take pictures of people smoking.

1:35:37 Speaker 3: They're taking pictures of like the flares.

1:35:39 Speaker 2: Why like I took I mean, I would they be taking pictures of flares in the first place.

1:35:44 Speaker 1: And I'm not I'm not trying to I'm not trying to.

1:35:46 Speaker 3: Battle, right, They're cool, Like they're cool, Like they're like, what else is they to take pictures of?

1:35:50 Speaker 4: You know, it's it's fun, you know, maybe the I don't know, you know, uh, you know, send to their uh look at this, this is cool, you know, send to you know, people like corbells, so that they can, you know, create a mass media frenzy over nothing.

1:36:03 Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know who can who can know what these men were thinking?

1:36:08 Speaker 2: Likes Well, you're you're certainly you know, suggesting you do know what they're thinking, and so I, you know, I I'll push.

1:36:18 Speaker 3: Back on that. I'm saying I'm doing the exact opposite, Arthur. I'm saying, we do not know. We have no way of knowing what they're thinking. I don't know how else to, like, can we put this on like a bit.

1:36:27 Speaker 2: But then you start creating narratives of what they might be thinking. It's okay, they're out there smoking. They're out there because it's too hot.

1:36:38 Speaker 3: Is that a narrative? I'll get Tony out of here. What he better be paying for that, right, you better be paying for that.

1:36:45 Speaker 2: I think that they're I think they're out there steering at the UFO. They're out there steering at the UFO.

1:36:53 Speaker 1: So again, this picture, in my in a neutral aspect, I just don't see that if this is a normal routine training exercise. I just I can't explain this picture. I mean, I guess I can. I guess, I guess I can. It's just it's not It's not a picture I would take, like in any circumstance of just people out in their underwear in the middle of the desert looking up at flares known.

1:37:35 Speaker 3: Flair would be surprised. What else would take pictures of, you know, when we're out there in the field, Like, I guess he's taking a picture of his friends looking at Flairs, like because he knows that he's probably Flairs. You know, he's probably taking a picture to laugh at him, you know later, like look at all you guys out there.

1:37:51 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I really want to stamp to you know. I completely disagree with this hoax idea that you keep saying that these are honorable men, they're not liars, they're not hoaxers, they're not manipulating what they saw. I think these are train marines. And I will continue to push back against your your accusations the guys or anything but trustworthy.

1:38:12 Speaker 3: See now you're making it about that. See that's a real bad that's a real evil stroll man I can tell that you really, you really think you're losing the the debate here Arthur to go that, look, well.

1:38:21 Speaker 2: It's because your entire your entire argument is based on these witnesses.

1:38:28 Speaker 3: It's not. No, it's not dude. That's a really low blow.

1:38:31 Speaker 2: But I mean, you know, well we can move on that. This is the last photo. We got two more. So here here's a couple more low light photos.

1:38:41 Speaker 3: I forgot the game where you like go under the bar, like, what is that called.

1:38:46 Speaker 2: Below the belt?

1:38:48 Speaker 3: No?

1:38:48 Speaker 1: No, no, ship, Yeah, no, I know what you're talking about that and you go like yeah, yeah, like what the hell is that called?

1:38:58 Speaker 7: What is it called?

1:39:00 Speaker 3: Just how you know?

1:39:02 Speaker 1: Just how in touch we are?

1:39:04 Speaker 3: I think we are lim limbo limbo.

1:39:08 Speaker 1: Yes, thank you guys, Thank you guys. The chat we have we have we have close to two thousand people watching, uh and only like twenty on YouTube. Yeah so literally YouTube mats me so much. It's so funny. But thank you. Please anyone who's watching, if you do, mind switching over from Twitter over to YouTube, uh and subscribe. I I know I'm pausing this a little bit, but it would really mean the world to me, uh, because I do try to bring content like this, give people platforms, uh, and to hear everybody out no matter what, no matter if it's Wick, Mick West, Stephen green Street, whether it's Robert Sallas, uh, Mario Woods.

1:40:01 Speaker 1: I have them all. So let's continue the debate. Guys.

1:40:05 Speaker 3: Oh, just like one more thing if I can do my own advertisement. So I'm gonna be here, okay, disclosure, Okay, a disclosure dinner with my disclosure whistleblower named Charles.

1:40:15 Speaker 4: We're gonna have you come to the you know, you come to the prison. We're gonna have grilled cheese off the radiator, you know, nice fancy meal. And for three thousand dollars you can have a talk with my my own disclosure whistleblower, all right, one on one, find out the real truths, and then afterwards.

1:40:31 Speaker 3: You go out and get shanked in on the basketball court. So three thousand dollars, I'll tell it. I'll knock it down to fifteen hundred for my friends on Twitter.

1:40:38 Speaker 1: All right, are you uh?

1:40:41 Speaker 3: Are you?

1:40:41 Speaker 1: Are you secretly doctor Greer?

1:40:44 Speaker 2: No, he's talking about this guy. You don't know about the prison whistle You'll.

1:40:50 Speaker 3: Get into it right now. That was the ke you know, let's let the joke marinate, all right. You know, I'll explain it to you later. But uh, doctor Greer, Hey, we could shift this in a doctor Greer and just get our hate on. You know, like I'm saying right now, I'm prore parachute flares. He does like career off the parachute flares.

1:41:08 Speaker 2: You know, I want to debunk that. We'll save that debunking. We'll save that debate for another day.

1:41:14 Speaker 3: But Arthur Man, you're just on the wrong side of all this.

1:41:17 Speaker 2: Man, Oh, you think everything is flares?

1:41:22 Speaker 3: I know. No, No, I do not. I do not. I absolutely do not believe you know, one verse of whatever you think. If I was a betting man, you know I bet the opposite.

1:41:37 Speaker 1: All right, Shots shots fired, right, I mean, he starts, no, no, no, no, no, it's okay, It's okay. Shots fired real back in. We got two pictures in front of us, two photos nineteen seconds apart. We're flying high, all right.

1:41:55 Speaker 2: So.

1:41:57 Speaker 1: Why we don't know exactly in reference from when the videos? So Grider, A big thing that you talk about is that there's no video longer than thirty seconds. There is a video longer than thirty seconds. There's a thirty six second video. But I will agree with you in the sense that there are four to five videos that total, if you were to sequentially add them up, only add up to about three or to four minutes maybe, And you've hedged a lot on that aspect. I don't understand. So the pictures here that we're seeing, we don't know when they were taken in reference to when the videos were taken.

1:42:53 Speaker 1: This has caused a lot of frustration. So I wish we could get some of the metadata from the videos and photos so that we could start saying.

1:43:02 Speaker 3: Here's the thing, though, I just want to at a fact to this.

1:43:07 Speaker 2: These are the only two photos that we have metadata on because these weren't These didn't come from Corbell. These came from a Reddit users, another witness. So we have to intact metadata from the iCloud so we can be confident when these were taken.

1:43:24 Speaker 4: Okay, so these are the photos? Yeah, because someone just DM me. Goodness, someone just dm me uh And I took a look briefly at it. I think I think this is like on you know, the second Mickwest debunk. Oh yeah, oh yeah, I'm a fed. Yeah, we're so delusional.

1:43:47 Speaker 1: But I started that comment.

1:43:50 Speaker 3: Oh it's cool, it's I mean's whatever, you know, it's I love that stuff. But yeah, so apparently these are the photos.

1:43:58 Speaker 4: No, No, I didn't, and I thought I only thought that because there's some erroneous work done by another.

1:44:04 Speaker 3: It's just not really. I'm okay, I take responsibilities. We'll go well, you know what, we're always trying to think outside the box.

1:44:09 Speaker 1: You know what, I'm the last, the last, the last twenty minutes of this.

1:44:14 Speaker 3: Well, well, you want to be cussing each other out, you know what I'm saying, Like, Yeah, we'll want to tell Arthur exactly what I think of a minute's freaking Cole's clearance rack attire? You know?

1:44:25 Speaker 1: Is that all that way into it?

1:44:26 Speaker 3: Oh, you're gonna find out.

1:44:28 Speaker 1: No, but I wanted to ask you a question about Ashton Forbes.

1:44:33 Speaker 3: No, I I defer. I've like, I really don't like to talk crap about people unless they're like right there. You know, if Ashton come on, like, we'll go back to the old days of me cussing them out, you know, and blowing up, and you can kick me out of the chat, you know, like I used to kick out of spaces, like we can go back to the old days. That's right. Now.

1:44:51 Speaker 1: I just wanted to know your views on it, all, right, Okay, anyway, so the metadata, the metadata would be very crucial to this case. Yes, in at least verifying when each video is taken, so that we could correspond and correlate that either you know, if there's overlap or or not, so that we could start piecing together timeframes. Grinder in your experience, Even if if flares were dropped from an osprey in this formation, how long would they stay in the air at alta minutes? Seven minutes? Okaytes, And that aligns with the research that we've done, that that Arthur and I have done.

1:45:39 Speaker 3: Now, okay, you guys, okay, you got a little research on your own.

1:45:42 Speaker 1: Okay, yes, so Arthur, yea, Arthur, Arthur, what what are the significance of these photos being nineteen seconds apart, uh taken by another user separate from the Corbell investigation?

1:46:06 Speaker 2: Well, they're they're very important for my research specifically because it's the only iPhone photos where we have a certainty what time they were taken. So later on I'll show that the Foya photos don't match up with the with the timeline from these two specific photos and in other words, the FOYA photos, which are you know, quote unquote debunking this case. We're taking much earlier and you can clearly see that the flares had burnt out at that point.

1:46:41 Speaker 3: So these are these are crucial. They took it earlier in preparation for the UFO that was going to appear like minutes later. Is that what? No?

1:46:54 Speaker 2: No, My My theory, I'll wrap it up pretty quickly is that there was a mass u ap siding at this base. It was an incursion by an unknown It caused a significant ruckus on the base with massive response, and that part of their information containment operation of this massive up siding was to at a later date stage a five light flare and a similar configuration so that at a later date that they could just publish those to instantly debunk the case before it gains traction.

1:47:33 Speaker 3: That's a that's a creative story.

1:47:35 Speaker 4: But how are you going to explain the fact that they had all these air assets scheduled for this exact time to be doing a training exercise where it was like literally they always.

1:47:45 Speaker 2: They're doing training exercises every day, every night.

1:47:48 Speaker 3: Aircraft like at this exact time, fifty aircraft, you know, multiple multiple altitudes, like stacked up at all I mean at all levels, coordinating with it. They're always training refueling point. Okay, well you know see.

1:48:04 Speaker 1: Well well let's let's let's let's let's stop flying guys.

1:48:10 Speaker 3: So I have the data, but you know, we're.

1:48:14 Speaker 2: Your point is that there was a training exercise that night, And I say, yes, there was a training exercise that night. There's training exercise.

1:48:23 Speaker 1: You're saying that all these.

1:48:26 Speaker 3: Air assets rushed into the area when I'm saying that they were they were scheduled to be in the area at that exact time.

1:48:32 Speaker 2: I had over Camp Wilson.

1:48:35 Speaker 3: Yes, over They were not over Camp Wilson, like they were over the training range. They were over the range like I have. I tried to pull out this you know proof earlier and I got shut down.

1:48:46 Speaker 1: Well yeah, I was gonna say this. If we're actually looking at this, this craft is far if sorry, I said craft, that's just that was my bad. This thing is over the mountain. It looks like to some degree, I would say that's.

1:49:05 Speaker 3: An aircraft off to the left too, right, like it's in that an aircraft. I have the ADSP data. I wonder you see that off to the left.

1:49:12 Speaker 1: I do see that off to the last.

1:49:14 Speaker 3: It's got to be an airplane, a civilian airliner.

1:49:17 Speaker 2: Oh, there's just a well how.

1:49:19 Speaker 1: Would that be how would that be cleared in that?

1:49:23 Speaker 3: I mean, that's probably way off.

1:49:25 Speaker 4: That's probably like okay, so o wait, so Camp Wilson is on like the bottom portion, like if you look at a map of twenty nine.

1:49:32 Speaker 3: In fact, I've got a map if you go to uh, if you go to number I have it right here.

1:49:40 Speaker 6: Yeah.

1:49:41 Speaker 3: Well you know I don't really want your map go to a number eleven. Yes, yes, not.

1:49:45 Speaker 2: This is Camp Wilson. So this is Camp Wilson on the left, weiber eleven. It's the training village.

1:49:54 Speaker 3: Yeah, I've got a better map.

1:49:57 Speaker 1: He actually does have a really good map.

1:50:00 Speaker 3: You got six of them.

1:50:05 Speaker 2: So the foyer photos were taking from this training village seventeen miles away from Camp Wilson.

1:50:16 Speaker 3: Yeah, so look okay, so right there you see right there and like the bottom left and like the bottom see that, like that's where Camp Wilson is right there in that kind of that you know that bottom left area right there? Uh more clothes, I mean it's like in that pocket you see it? Okay, so dang, I wish you could see my so well.

1:50:34 Speaker 1: All right, bottom left, it draw me to where you are right there.

1:50:38 Speaker 4: It's like right, you know, like Camp Wilson in the airport and everything is that's right there in the right side of that uh tan area, that really khaki colored area that doesn't have any you know, circles over it or any it's like that. All the lines are around you see what I'm saying, But it's still marked off by that solid black line at the bottom.

1:51:00 Speaker 3: You see how it kind of there's a black line.

1:51:02 Speaker 2: It's really hard to describe. You'd have to put your cursor right there.

1:51:05 Speaker 1: To Yeah, I'm having a hard time with it. Well all right, all right, all right, you labeled them one, two, three, four, five, six, let's uh, let's stay on number one and guide me.

1:51:19 Speaker 3: Those are coordinators though with like the data that I had, like which you don't want to go in, which we don't want to get into right now.

1:51:25 Speaker 1: So no, we'll get into it here.

1:51:28 Speaker 3: Hold on, hold on, hold on, yeah, I mean probably let's go in and save this. And like I was just trying to show you guys where Camp Wilson. Is is what I was doing? All right?

1:51:42 Speaker 1: Well yeah he was too, to be fair, so but but you're right, this is it doesn't really give us a good clear picture of the the the terrain, the all around terrain.

1:51:59 Speaker 2: This is Camp Wilson as well.

1:52:04 Speaker 3: Right, hey, so hey, so go to uh go to uh number twenty. All right, number twenty.

1:52:11 Speaker 4: It's a four. It's a four collage in the top right, it's got a really good map. Uh that is the actual map that came with the Foyer request materials. So number twenty, it'll be like a couple of tables on the bottom and then a some type of chart where it you know, it has all the different activities that are going on during that time, and then the right will be a.

1:52:33 Speaker 3: Blue map says like be yeah, there we go. Is there any way you can zoom into the top right?

1:52:38 Speaker 1: Unfortunately, okay, I doesn't say it's not letting me zoom in. But I did actually add it into my photos. Let me see if I can, if I can get a better copy of it. Uppere No, it doesn't work, no, unfortunately not.

1:53:10 Speaker 4: I just sent it to the It's it's the newest thing on the media, and it should pull up like a full screen. It's really not very clear.

1:53:18 Speaker 2: But what did you say, Jeremy Corbell's retweeting us.

1:53:33 Speaker 1: Yeah, Hey, shout out to Jeremy Corbell.

1:53:39 Speaker 4: Jeremy Man, I'm sending right now, sending a high death version of it. Uh so it's it's taken a minute from my internet to send it.

1:53:48 Speaker 3: You know, don't have good high death version of the entire There we go.

1:53:56 Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, I got it.

1:54:00 Speaker 3: And if you look at Camp Wilson is in the bottom left, you see right there in the middle, that's the range, all right, So that's that's where they do most of their dropping of like uh you know, aircraft like air to ground type of type of type of m armament. And this is the actually just from the foyer requests that I sent it to the media group group DM.

1:54:30 Speaker 2: There.

1:54:32 Speaker 1: Fuck me, I don't want to teach this so much time.

1:54:36 Speaker 3: No, no, like go to the go to the go to the media.

1:54:38 Speaker 1: No, I'm on it right now.

1:54:40 Speaker 3: You're there. And there's not two uh two blue maps that got sent.

1:54:45 Speaker 1: No, but it got sent to my phone. It's weird. I feel like an idiot right now. We're just holding everybody out.

1:54:53 Speaker 3: No, man, it's not you do it's X you know, it's they're always glitchen because I got them.

1:54:59 Speaker 1: Okay, I'm gonna yeah, oh wow, these are actually Yeah, I want you to do that real quick, please, just so we don't have any gaps and no problem. But yeah, so Jeremy, if Jeremy, if you watch, I would talk to you about this case and about a bunch of other things. That's what I'm I want is the metadata so that we can start start correlating whether or not that we have enough time in the videos add it up that don't overlap to to get near his seven minute time frame, because that could show us a lot if if we can show that these things stayed in formation for as close to seven minutes as possible, then and I mean for me, that says something because like like you said, hold on.

1:56:07 Speaker 3: Arthur, all right, So my wish if we're doing our you know, Jeremy Corbel, Jeanie in the bottle with I just want to I just want to party with Bob Bazaar and George Knapp for a week and I want let's go to the.

1:56:19 Speaker 4: Let's get it done. You know what I'm saying. That's all that I want actually more fun than all this stuff.

1:56:26 Speaker 3: You know.

1:56:27 Speaker 1: Yeah, I retract my statement. I'm with Grider now. I just want to party with Corbel and and George.

1:56:35 Speaker 4: You know, George Knapp and Bob Bazaar threw down back in the day, right, I bet they tore Vegas up.

1:56:43 Speaker 4: I can't even imagine ohory days.

1:56:47 Speaker 3: All right, So look and you see, uh yeah, so in the bottom left there's like a blue Oh yeah, that's right.

1:56:58 Speaker 4: So right there is right there is Fob Wilson, and then there's the range and uh yeah, and then this range is where I'm pretty sure that's this, and then it looks like maybe Sunshine Peak is the same type of you know, topographical notation. I don't know what you would call that, you know, the map feature or whatever.

1:57:18 Speaker 3: The lines.

1:57:19 Speaker 4: It basically annotates where they can drop air to ground ordinance. You know, it's in a specific area because you know, you have to think when you're dropping air to ground ordinance, you have to worry and flares which in the year so the only figure that I was able to find was in the year twenty ten, they dropped close to twenty thousand flares, you know, twenty thousand lu to Lou nineteen flares over twenty nine palms.

1:57:44 Speaker 3: That's a lot.

1:57:45 Speaker 4: So that's a I mean, that's a lot of potential to start a fire, and so you would think, you know, that's why they keep it controlled in this one area right here would be my assumption. And then this night they had operations going on Objective A, Objective B. I think Objective B is possibly where the photo was taken from and where they had the refueling point set up, I'm pretty sure. And then they had something going on at Black Top two right over here, and you know there's Gaze Pass and Rainbow Canyon.

1:58:18 Speaker 3: You know, they're really creative with names, but.

1:58:21 Speaker 2: A lot of people might not understand how big this is. This is the largest, you know, square mile of largest marine base in the entire world, so they have an enormous amount of space to do their exercise.

1:58:34 Speaker 4: And one thing to point out is that look at so this photo right here, this is where this is where it was taken right here, So this is where the other photos. We got one photo right here, one photographer right here. Then we got the marines right here. And look where the right here is where the flares were dropped over.

1:58:49 Speaker 2: Now there's no legend on here. There's no legend. I don't see a legend for this.

1:58:54 Speaker 3: I'm telling you what it stands for. I mean, it says range. Right there.

1:58:57 Speaker 2: You're telling me without a legend, that you know what this map means.

1:59:03 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's range right there. That's range.

1:59:07 Speaker 2: They're all ranges. It's a mountain range. I think that means. I think that means a mountain range. I think that's.

1:59:17 Speaker 1: Ire. But but, but but I did say earlier that Camp Wilson is where you stage before you go to the range. So that would align with what my cousin, who was stationed on the base set, So I.

1:59:32 Speaker 3: Don't know, downrange like downrange. Maybe that's what you meant.

1:59:36 Speaker 2: No, I think what he was saying is that this is a massive base and that Camp Wilson is where they stage and get ready. They don't actually launch munitions at Camp Wilson. They go off out further into.

1:59:49 Speaker 3: The base to launch their Yeah, right there, they launch it right over the range, right in the range.

1:59:57 Speaker 2: The mountain range. That's a mountain range, all right.

2:00:00 Speaker 1: So I think we have a dispute about that.

2:00:03 Speaker 3: This is a topographical map though this is like right.

2:00:06 Speaker 1: I was gonna say where would the mountain be that we're seeing, you know, so you know in all the videos, I'm sorry, the pictures that we were just seeing. If you could with your cursor, could you show roughly where you where the mountain is in in in the.

2:00:26 Speaker 3: There's mountains like look, okay, so can you side by side this mountains?

2:00:33 Speaker 1: See this big ass hill to the left, Yeah.

2:00:36 Speaker 3: That's right there. It's where the range is. This. This is it.

2:00:39 Speaker 4: Like you can see the beginning of the topographical you know thing for a change in elevation right here, Like you can see that beginning right here, and then the range covers it up.

2:00:49 Speaker 3: You can see, look right there, there's more. There's more on the backside. This is the mountain range right here.

2:00:54 Speaker 4: This is not they wouldn't like, is there any other topographical feature that is annotated on this map.

2:01:02 Speaker 3: Range means range as in the range where you fire, where you drop like air to ground.

2:01:07 Speaker 2: And those are all ranges. Those are all a bunch of different ranges.

2:01:12 Speaker 4: I mean, I'm telling you that that would be incorrect. Uh, that would be incorrect as far as you know, as far as what the map shows.

2:01:19 Speaker 2: Up, well as far as the geography. Can you actually put both of our things up at the same time, this one as well as mine that I'm sharing that possible.

2:01:31 Speaker 4: I mean, look, there's like the city right there's probably the city of twenty nine Palms, and right here, like the whole point that we brought up this map for is to see the boundary and to see if that photo was taken from the opposite side of the mountain going back towards, and that means that the that the aircraft would have been flying right along here.

2:01:52 Speaker 3: I guess it would have been flying.

2:01:54 Speaker 2: Uh.

2:01:54 Speaker 4: And I've got the ADSB that I can pull up and that we'll see a plane flying right along here. But I've been wrong before.

2:02:02 Speaker 3: I could be wrong.

2:02:05 Speaker 1: There's no way, there's no way for me to pull both of them up.

2:02:09 Speaker 2: It's okay, I think we're in the weeds a little bit here.

2:02:13 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think we need to So that's what I was gonna say, is I think we need to fly back a little bit and get back to Let's get back, Let's get off of that, Let's get off of that section. Where do you guys want to go next? The witnesses? Okay, so we're.

2:02:31 Speaker 6: Gonna be.

2:02:34 Speaker 3: No. So I mean just meaning like I'll let him drive the conversation. I mean, he knows the case.

2:02:38 Speaker 1: Better than I respect that friend, I really do. So where where am I going for this?

2:02:46 Speaker 2: Look in the media thread and then you should see right after I posted all the videos five witnesses.

2:02:54 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's right.

2:02:56 Speaker 3: Okay, I gotta throw my taco meat on the on the of and so I'll be I'll still be listening, but give me like three minutes. I won't be speaking back.

2:03:06 Speaker 1: So far, guys. I was just saying, I was gonna say, do you guys want to take a take a quick five? We are two hours in.

2:03:14 Speaker 2: Yeah, I need to take a quick I think I think the audience.

2:03:17 Speaker 1: I think the audience would understand if we took a quick five minutes at two hours. Okay, yeah, and listen, listen we have we have roughly two thousand people here. Jeremy Corbel shared and gave us all credit for participating in this, so I expect that more people will be chiming in and coming in soon as as this develops. So, guys, we are in the middle. I don't care how long this goes. It's it's all for you, guys.

2:03:53 Speaker 3: Uh this I can go and beat Arthur up on that too, you know what I mean, we'll probably opposing points on it, right. I think it's a helicite.

2:04:01 Speaker 1: The jellyfish one is really interesting though.

2:04:06 Speaker 3: Well it's all right, Well, you know what I'm gonna have.

2:04:11 Speaker 2: I'll have another debate.

2:04:13 Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna say, you guys are really fun. So all right, guys, we'll be right back after these messages.

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